DRS12A with TZT3

[fishermandan21]

Guys, forgive my ignorance on this. I tried searching, but I'm tight on time right now.

I'm interested in purchasing a radar (DRS12A). I have a TZT16F and SCX20 on NMEA2k. Any compatibility issues I should be worrying about since the radar is older? Am I losing any functionality with this older model radar...as in, will it work in conjunction with the SCX20?

Seller states, "Complete Furuno DRS12A Radar with gear box, antenna power supply and cable."

Thanks,

Dan

 

[Magnetron]

It should be fine, the TZT2/3 supports that radar and there's no real functionality you'll be missing out on. You can check out the product info, software history, etc. on our website (links below). :wink7

TZT Brochure (See compatibility on pg16): https://furunousa.com/-/media/sites/fur ... ochure.pdf

DRS12A Technical Support Page: https://furunousa.com/en/support/DRS12A

Hope this helps!

- Maggy :sail

 

[fishermandan21]

Thank you...I did more browsing and was able to verify compatibility on FURUNO website. I was just nervous about missing any possible networking or features...hence coming to the experts for a quick check in!

Thanks again.

 

[Magnetron]

Thank you...I did more browsing and was able to verify compatibility on FURUNO website. I was just nervous about missing any possible networking or features...hence coming to the experts for a quick check in!

Thanks again.

Thank you for choosing Furuno! :jump :jump

- Maggy :furuno

 

[fishermandan21]

Of course, I love my Furuno equipment...very satisfied.

There are 2 things that could use some improvement that have been frustrating.

1 - mapping options
2 - tracks and storage. Wish I could just add some storage and continue. I had no idea I would run out of tracks after less than 100hr run time on the GPS. Now I have to delete tracks I don't want deleted! From what I understand I have to delete to free up storage and then I have to change my settings on how the tracks are stored?

Back to radar.....any tips or recommendations prior to installation? There may be threads on this, so a link would also work. I understand certain areas need to be siliconed very well to prevent possible water intrusion. This is my first open array and I believe the degree on my hard time should be very precise compared to domes I've had in the past.

Thanks in advance as always,

Dan

 

[Magnetron]

Our Chart selection is ever changing as new cartography options enter the market, so hang in there while we're actively evaluating options and working to give the best user experience. Meanwhile, have you explored our TZ3 PBG Sea Floor mapping options with the DFF3D?

For tracks, the best thing you can do with a new unit is navigate to Home > Settings > Ship and Track > And Toggle on "Automatic Track Deleting" and while you're at it change track interval to "Distance" rather than "time" with maybe an interval of .5 to 1 NM. Settings like that will give you much better tracks while not filling up memory so often. :cool

Give those tricks a try and let us know,

- Maggy :sail

 

[Magnetron]

Back to radar.....any tips or recommendations prior to installation? There may be threads on this, so a link would also work. I understand certain areas need to be siliconed very well to prevent possible water intrusion. This is my first open array and I believe the degree on my hard time should be very precise compared to domes I've had in the past.

Thanks in advance as always,

Dan

It should go smooth, what's most important will be highlighted in the installation manual so read and re-read it for the best installation advice!

In general, yes you should pay special attention after it's installed (and tested working) to go back and silicon seal the bolts underneath (also specified in the manual)

If you run into any hitches, Search the forums and of course Furuno Support is available,

- Maggy :sail

 

[fishermandan21]

Been out on a couple trips and works great.

I'm seeing weather as far as I could want and I can mark boats extremely easily over 8 miles out.

Now...any recommendations on settings for bird finding? I haven't exactly ran into anything I feel I should've been marking on the screen, but would like to get that dialed in.

Any help is appreciated.

 

[Quitsa]

Of course, I love my Furuno equipment...very satisfied.

There are 2 things that could use some improvement that have been frustrating.

1 - mapping options
2 - tracks and storage. Wish I could just add some storage and continue. I had no idea I would run out of tracks after less than 100hr run time on the GPS. Now I have to delete tracks I don't want deleted! From what I understand I have to delete to free up storage and then I have to change my settings on how the tracks are stored?

Back to radar.....any tips or recommendations prior to installation? There may be threads on this, so a link would also work. I understand certain areas need to be siliconed very well to prevent possible water intrusion. This is my first open array and I believe the degree on my hard time should be very precise compared to domes I've had in the past.

Thanks in advance as always,

Dan

For tracks that you want to save for future reference, you can work around the track point limit by saving the track as a route.The unit will store 200 routes. That doesn't displace the track storage. It is also possible to export the routes to an SD card (if you have a card reader) or USB stick using the file function. So if you convert the tracks to routes and export them to an external storage device, you could save a vast number. I prefer converting to routes over just exporting tracks, which is another way you could expand the quantity of saved tracks. With routes, it is possible to save the track with a descriptive name ("Yellowfin Trip 6-19-21" for example) which is more useful that just a track number.

As for tuning the radar for seeing birds, you might read the targeting birds section of this document that is on the Furuno website: https://furunousa.com/en/get_support/le ... r_handbook

It is simple, all you are doing is turning off the sea state and rain filters and adjusting the gain to the highest setting that leaves some speckles on the display without the gain being so high the noise obscures targets.

I had a DRS12A radar on my old boat with a four foot array. It did an excellent job showing birds at ranges out to 6 miles or more on days when it was not too rough. You should be very pleased with it once you become comfortable with manually tuning it and knowing how to interpret the bird targets.

 

[fishermandan21]

Thanks for the feedback. I did have my gain up to 100% without having any clutter on my radar screen...but I didn't touch the sea state and rain filters. I need to play around with those settings as well.

/ I'll read that link...thanks again.

 

[Magnetron]

Now...any recommendations on settings for bird finding? I haven't exactly ran into anything I feel I should've been marking on the screen, but would like to get that dialed in.

Any help is appreciated.

Adjusting the A/C Rain controls is like tweaking the color filters in your favorite smartphone photo editing app;

In technical terms, we explain in the radar guide:

The Rain control, also called FTC
(Fast Time Constant), suppresses the reflected echoes
from rain, hail and snow to clear the display. On the
X band Radar, because of its short pulse length, the
echoes from legitimate contacts can become lost in the
echoes from precipitation, called rain clutter. When
rain clutter masks the display, adjust this control to
break up the clutter and distinguish echoes. Adjust the
control so that the clutter just disappears; too much
A/C Rain action may shrink or erase the echoes from
legitimate targets.

Reference P.6

As you can tell gain is just a big global sensitivity knob On/Off, the more finer tuning controls are in adjusting the Fast Time Constant in order to "see objects" in the greater big blob.

Hope this helps, :sail

- Maggy

 

[fishermandan21]

Bumping this thread for the sake of not creating a new one...

I'm finally getting around to updating my DRS12A. I understand this must be done through a PC hooked up to a hub/switch (correct me if I'm wrong).

The diagram shows the TZT hooking up to the hub with a dotted line rather than a solid line. Will the hub (regular ethernet switch in my case) have the radar, pc and TZT...or just the radar and PC?

2nd question is in regards to the IP address. Could you provide the easiest way to change the IP address on the PC in order to do this update? I'm assuming I don't need to be connected to internet since the update is downloaded to the PC?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Johnny Electron]

You only need the radar and the PC connected to the hub whenever conducting a PC update of the radar.

Changing the IP of your PC network device depends on the version of windows you are running. Instructions are normally found if you google the version of windows you are running along with "Changing PC IP address". Some PCs share resources and require that you turn off your wi-fi for the IP to change. I also recommend turning off any firewalls and anti-virus programs that might block communications, when conducting the update process.

 

[fishermandan21]

You only need the radar and the PC connected to the hub whenever conducting a PC update of the radar.

Changing the IP of your PC network device depends on the version of windows you are running. Instructions are normally found if you google the version of windows you are running along with "Changing PC IP address". Some PCs share resources and require that you turn off your wi-fi for the IP to change. I also recommend turning off any firewalls and anti-virus programs that might block communications, when conducting the update process.

Thanks for the info....just curious, anything in the update that I'll notice beside Bird Mode?

 

[Johnny Electron]

The full software update history is posted under the software tab of the product.

https://www.furunousa.com/-/media/sites/furuno/software_library/software/software/drs_software_history.pdf

Biggest thing people notice is the radar will work with the newer TZT units because if not upgraded it won't work at all except to a NN3D.

 

[Quitsa]

Thanks for the info....just curious, anything in the update that I'll notice beside Bird Mode?

I used to have that radar. It is really very good at showing birds at long ranges. My way of tuning for birds was pretty simple and seemed to work well under most conditions. First turn off both the auto rain and sea state filters and set to zero. Next, choose the range out to which you want to try and find birds. I would normally use 8 miles or less -- even if I saw a flock of birds at 8 or 10 miles, by the time I could get there the fish would likely be gone anyway. Finally, increase the gain until you see a lot of noise/speckles, then back it down until most but not all of the speckles clear. Often it is helpful to turn on the target trails, especially if larger birds are what you are looking to see.

On days with rough seas, you will often need to leave more noise on the screen to see birds or you can manually use a low sea state filter setting to clear up some of the returns from the waves. The auto sea state setting will also block many of the bird returns so generally it is not a good idea to use it except when using the radar for navigation.

I have a DRS25A-NXT solid state radar now and my observation is that manual tuning will show more birds than "bird mode". The only advantage of bird mode is that you do not have to retune when changing the range. At least that's my opinion. I am not persuaded that Furuno or the other electronics manufacturers have some magical secret settings algorithm for "bird mode" that gives better performance than manual tuning.

 

[fishermandan21]

I used to have that radar. It is really very good at showing birds at long ranges. My way of tuning for birds was pretty simple and seemed to work well under most conditions. First turn off both the auto rain and sea state filters and set to zero. Next, choose the range out to which you want to try and find birds. I would normally use 8 miles or less -- even if I saw a flock of birds at 8 or 10 miles, by the time I could get there the fish would likely be gone anyway. Finally, increase the gain until you see a lot of noise/speckles, then back it down until most but not all of the speckles clear. Often it is helpful to turn on the target trails, especially if larger birds are what you are looking to see.

On days with rough seas, you will often need to leave more noise on the screen to see birds or you can manually use a low sea state filter setting to clear up some of the returns from the waves. The auto sea state setting will also block many of the bird returns so generally it is not a good idea to use it except when using the radar for navigation.

I have a DRS25A-NXT solid state radar now and my observation is that manual tuning will show more birds than "bird mode". The only advantage of bird mode is that you do not have to retune when changing the range. At least that's my opinion. I am not persuaded that Furuno or the other electronics manufacturers have some magical secret settings algorithm for "bird mode" that gives better performance than manual tuning.

Thanks for the update, that's pretty close to how I've been using the settings, but I'll make sure to keep it as close to what you just stated. Appreciate the info. How do you like the NXT vs the old magnetron? Obviously you have more power now at 200watts. I'm always tempted for an upgrade but I feel like I won't be gaining much other than a hole in my bank account lol

 

[Quitsa]

Thanks for the update, that's pretty close to how I've been using the settings, but I'll make sure to keep it as close to what you just stated. Appreciate the info. How do you like the NXT vs the old magnetron? Obviously you have more power now at 200watts. I'm always tempted for an upgrade but I feel like I won't be gaining much other than a hole in my bank account lol

In my case it isn't quite an apples to apples comparison because when I had the 12kW magnetron, I has a four foot array. I have a six foot on the DRS25A-NXT. That definitely helps resolving small targets like birds or small pot floats or debris on the water. On balance, I would say for bird finding there is not too much difference in performance between my new solid state radar and the magnetron. That is actually a major plus for Furuno because up to now, from my experience no recreational solid state radar provided decent bird finding.

It isn't really correct to view the DRS25A-NXT at 200W as having more power than a 12kW magnetron. They don't work the same way so comparing power output is not meaningful. The nominal power of the 12kW magnetron is 60 times greater than the solid state radar but what matters is the signal reflected back from the targets and how it is processed and displayed.

The DRS25A-NXT radar is definitely superior for navigation. It does a better job acquiring and tracking targets and showing their speed and course, which it does both faster and more accurately. But to keep things in perspective, I would take your DRS12A over any of the competing manufacturers' radars any day of the year.