Old eyes

[pprior]

I am a brand new "big boy" boater - have had lake boats for years but buying my first ocean-going boat. It's a full displacement trawler. So it's slow.

The instrumentation is ancient (original 23+ years old). Pic below.

I would like to get new navigation, chart plotter, autopilot, radar. It's all super expensive though. The difference/jump in price as screen size increases seems absurd to me given that AFAIK the guts inside aren't that much different. I was just at Costco and they had the biggest TV I have ever seen I think it was 98" for like 1500 bucks.....

My concern is that if I stay in my budget and get a smaller screen that I might not be able to read it clearly and always have to be zooming in.

Can those of you in the 50 and up crowd maybe comment on screen size and bifocals/progressives, etc. it's a big big investment to me so I appreciate any feedback.

I presume two is better than one for redundancy - but again only so much will fit physically and in my budget.

 

[Johnny Electron]

It is hard to outfit electronics on the cheap for a boat. The best way to save money is do all the work yourself if you have the skills. There is a huge difference on costco displays and any brands MFDs in price, longevity and function. You are unlikely to see a household panel last long in boat heat and direct sunlight under many voyages. Being new to big boating it isn't much difference between smaller boating except even more $$. They did tell what what BOAT stand for when you purchased it, right? "B"ring "O"ut "A"nother "T"housand. Keeping in mind that joke is closer to reality than be a joke nowadays as prices have gone up. They did lay it out nicely back in the day. It looks like a nice good size ride.

 

[pprior]

The Costco remark was a bit tongue in cheek but not entirely -I would be very interested to see the profit margins as panel size increases - I don't think it's about engineering and production costs.

but that aside, I understand development costs, small markets, etc cause these things not to be cheap and it wasn't intended to be a rant.

It's more I would really dread spending the money and potentially time doing all the install only to find the smaller displays (that I find more price attractive or that I might be forced to accept if I want two displays in my space) unsuitable for my eyes. Hence hoping some of my more seasoned forum members might chime in on.

Brightness is also an issue for me - every time I pick up my wife or kids iPhone the first thing I do is turn the brightness up so it seems clearer to me.

 

[sheakx]

I would get the largest single MFD that will fit without major surgery and not do dual displays. Keep the Yanmar gages if they are working properly. You can move them to the sides if that gives you more room for the MFD. Redundancy is not really necessary and the screen can be split if you want. After having an SCX-20, I believe this is a necessary addition. The heading information is extremely accurate and the chart plotter, radar, auto pilot nav routing, course information, etc. align perfectly which is difficult to do with a fluxgate compass. A TEU001 mounted in easy reach to the helm seat makes it very easy to zoom in and out and mounting the auto pilot display close makes course adjustments equally easy. DIY will probably save you 50% if you are comfortable with wiring, network configuration, and cutting holes. There are companies that will make custom flat black panels to cover up the original swiss cheese panel and look OEM. I have a 13" display (barely fits) and find that works for me but would have put in a larger display if it were possible.

 

[rockfshr]

I agree with sheakx’s comments. Get the biggest screen that will fit. Definitely get the scx20. Don’t go cheap on your electronics. When you’re out in the middle of nowhere at night in rough weather you will be dam glad to have a Furuno MFD in your face guiding you to safely. That’s priceless! I’m in my 70’s so I know old eyes.

 

[pprior]

Thanks both of you. I was kind of leaning that way (one big screen) but the old adage two is one and one is none was really on my mind.

Appreciate the recommendation for SCX-20 - there are SO many bits and bobs it's hard to know what to add and what is superfluous.

I definitely plan to DIY - can't afford to pay someone 5-10 grand. I've done wiring and networking for a long time and carpentry is fun. I had assumed I would have to create a whole new wood face and remount all the gauges - interesting comment about just a new black panel will have to look into that.

Not sure if it's forum allowed, but any specific vendors for the gear or install goodies would be appreciated. Again thanks for the feedback thus far.

 

[FishTech]

We stay neutral with our dealers and resellers. Though some are on this forum and could speak up.
Click here to find dealers in your area. There are also dealers that are online focused for the DIY crowd.

 

[Quitsa]

Do you have any other nearby surfaces on which you could mount some of the displays? I agree with the comments about using a single large display in preference to multiple smaller ones and getting an SCX-20 satellite compass.

Looking at what's installed now, I think you could eliminate several items that are out of date or of very limited utility. My candidates in order of priority would be the Si-Tex ADF, the Raytheon depth meter, and the Furuno GP-32. I have no idea what is under the items with covers so maybe some of those can be removed as well.

You could consider relocating the Flo-Scan gauges and the rotary knobs under the port Flo-Scan to the above the Yanmar tach or to the lower panel. That will give you probably enough space for a single 19" MFD once the Raymarine is taken out. If you can stretch your budget, I would give serious consideration to two 16" MFDs instead, especially since I assume you will be replacing or installing radar.

For a trawler, I would look at an Airmar DST-810 transducer that will give you depth, water temperature ,and speed through the water data. Speed through the water can be quite help with a slower boat because the effect of currents becomes very apparent by comparing it to the speed over the ground from GPS.

It will be tough to get a good match trying to fabricate a new wood panel. The expedient of using a new black or dark grey matte Starboard panel will be much less work and cheaper. You may be able to get away with 3/8" since it will be well supported if you mount on top of the existing wood.

I will send you a private message about dealers.

 

[jp498]

I'd try to consolidate all the engine instruments in one area.
A new MFD will show depth, position, radar, chart, and replace a number of items with one piece. Get as big as you can afford.
The larger high brightness and high resolution displays are all fairly low production non-mass-market parts made of industrial markets. You get what you pay for in terms of brightness and ruggedness. You could use a business computer screen, but if it's a daylight area it is not ideal.

As mentioned you could start with a SCX20, small NMEA network if you don't have one with the autopilot. If it's the silly simnet stuff they make adaptors to convert to NMEA2000. An NMEA2000-0183 converter would provide data in a format that would replace the data output of the GP32. Many people have GP32 just to provide position/cog-sog to other instruments and don't actually use it to navigate by numbers.

 

[Permit Me]

Thanks both of you. I was kind of leaning that way (one big screen) but the old adage two is one and one is none was really on my mind.

Appreciate the recommendation for SCX-20 - there are SO many bits and bobs it's hard to know what to add and what is superfluous.

I definitely plan to DIY - can't afford to pay someone 5-10 grand. I've done wiring and networking for a long time and carpentry is fun. I had assumed I would have to create a whole new wood face and remount all the gauges - interesting comment about just a new black panel will have to look into that.

Not sure if it's forum allowed, but any specific vendors for the gear or install goodies would be appreciated. Again thanks for the feedback thus far.

@pprior We can't recommend one dealer over the other, but below is a link to our "Where To Buy" section of the Furuno USA website. Simply enter your location and the authorized Dealer/Resellers in your area will be shown with contact information.

https://furunousa.com/en/company/find_a_dealer

 

[pprior]

I've spent more time looking at this and below is an image marked up. I am having trouble finding exact measurements and I'm REALLY close.

It’s hard to find actual size data on Furuno MFD.

I have a space that is 30.5” wide and 10 and 7/8” tall on my helm (pictures and measurements drawing attached below). Everything other than the Yanmar stuff at very bottom will be removed. I will keep the flow scan dials but move them out to the sides so the middle rectangular area that I marked in the picture is available.

I believe that 2 x TZtouchXL TZT16X can JUST fit in this space. I’m not sure what requirements they would have in terms of support in the middle. I’ve seen pictures of “solid glass” helms so I presume that they can be directly abutted up against each other.

Will it fit? Will the dust covers go on? Does it need more space at the sides?

 

[FishTech]

Page 24 of the TZTXL brochure has all that data.
They can be mounted tight alongside each other.
The TZTXL sun covers will still fit.

https://furunousa.com/-/media/sites/furuno/document_library/documents/brochures/brochures/navnet-tztxl-brochure-2024.pdf

 

[pprior]

Thank you for that - I've been unable to find an installation video on YouTube for this newest generation. The older generations appear to have brackets on the sides that extend outwards and attach from the rear and I don't see those listed. Looking at the pictures shown on that page and shown above I only see what look like screw or bolt attachments on the top and bottom.

Have the side brackets that push from behind been removed as a design feature? If not, where do I find information on the space required for their installation - if they are present do they go beyond the width of the outer bezel?

Really appreciate the help - I am very space constrained so want to make sure it will actually fit before I order the wrong product.

 

[FishTech]

Yes! That was something many people asked for. The TZTXL series mounts from the front. There are bezels on the top and bottom that cover screw holes. No more brackets in the back.

 

[pprior]

That is great!! Thank you so much I will be able to fix two of the 16s then.

 

[Quitsa]

That is great!! Thank you so much I will be able to fix two of the 16s then.

I think the sun covers extend a little bit past the bezel so check if you need to leave a little extra space between the units. XL requires much less than TZT3, however. With an enclosed helm, it isn’t critical to use the sun covers. I don’t use mine with TZT3s because they are flush mounted into the panel and won’t go on. It hasn’t been a problem in four years.