New System Questions

Da Nag

New member
Greetings, all. I've been out of the boating scene for about 5 years, new vessel arrives in about a month. It's an older C-Dory 25 and a complete electronics retrofit is being planned.

After doing a bit of research on current offerings, I'm leaning strongly towards Furuno this time around. I spent close to 30 minutes on the phone with tech support yesterday with pre-sales questions, and what a breath of fresh air. They pointed me down the right path, but there are still many decisions to be made.

Use will be 90% cruising in PNW and Canadian waters, occasional fishing. Items that have been decided on:

- TXT12F MFD
- DRS4D-NXT 24" RADAR
- NavPilot 300

Items I'm investigating and would welcome input on:

- Transducer. I'm really ignorant here. The boat currently has a thru-hull for the old Garmin MFD. For basic depth readings, which I think will be the majority of my use - it functions beautifully, even at 30+ knots. Should it be replaced, Furuno suggested a basic 600W 525STID-MSD to a B275 on the high end. For those of you primarily cruising, is there a justification in your minds for the significantly more expensive Chirp transducers?

- Compass. My NSS system on my Nordic used a magnetic fluxgate unit and worked perfectly fine for the AP. In the Furuno world, it looks like I can go with the PG700 if I stick with magnetic or the GPS SCX20 at about double the price. Again, $$ will be spent if justified - but for those of you who own it, what features of the SCX20 made you go that route?

Thanks for any input. No doubt, more questions to come.
 
Hi Da Nag,

Welcome to the forum. I am glad to hear the tech support guys were helpful.

If the old transducer is an Airmar made for Garmin, you might consider leaving it in place. You would just cut off the Garmin connector and wire on a Furuno Pigtail cable to plug it into the back of the MFD. If it has been working well, it would save work and cost. CHIRP is nice in shallow waters but some of the simpler 50/200 transducers work really well and offer some of the advanced features like Accufish depending on the model. If you can find the Airmar or Garmin part number on the Garmin tag I can check to see what it is.
If you have a working compass, I would definitely try that before buying anything else. As long as it provides good data, it should work very well. I don't see you needing an SCX20 at this point. I say good data because my first NP300 install didn't go well because I had a compass from another company that would go off 20 degrees if the boat pitched up or down during acceleration and deceleration. A pilot will only be as good as your heading and hydraulics allow it to be.
 
Thanks for the quick reply! The existing thru-hull transducer is connected to a Garmin 2006C, but I don't know the model yet. Boat to be fetched in a few weeks. Tech support also suggested it may be compatible with a connector change, but of course - absent the model number they couldn't say with certainty. Sounds like a great place to save some $$, at least trying it first before upgrading if needed.

There is no magnetic/electronic compass currently on the boat. My preference is to stick with Furuno equipment absent a reason not to, and I'm fairly certain I'll have good locations away from magnetic interference to install the PG700.

I'm also hoping to incorporate engine telemetry from the 2017 Suzuki 200 outboard. I think it has NMEA 2000 capabilities, and does have the electronic display showing fuel burn, range, etc. As cool as that gauge is, there's not much room on the dash...I'm hopeful I can lose the electronic Suzuki gauge, putting the NavPilot 300 in its place. I'd only do that if the data the Suzuki gauge displays can be replicated on the MFD, though.

And, an AIS transponder is under consideration - but that's the one area I'm considering a non-Furuno device. I've heard nothing but good about the Vesper unit, but plenty of research to do there as well.

Thanks again, Johnny!
 
All sounds like a good plan. As long as you can get NMEA 2000 engine PGN information from the Suzukis it will show on the Navnet. Normally that means a Suzuki engine interface/gateway to your 2000 bus unless your other gages has NMEA 2000 output. If you have no compass, then the PG700 or SCX20 would be in order. It really isn't that much more for the SCX20 but the advantages are huge. Radar overlay, ARPA targets, and pilots all work better. The only problem with the SCX20 is the supply. They are a really hot product. Everyone loves them and wants them.
 
The SCX20 is a major advantage. Everything is aligned perfectly always if using radar overlay. Autopilot is more accurate (if you've ever had a magnetic sensor be off heading one direction and correct when heading another direction, that's a thing of the past) If you need to save money, keep the transducer and spend on the SCX20.
 
As far as transducers.... Chirp can emphasize some fish in the water column, though 50khz on a 50/200 does that well too. 1kw such as the b275 or a traditional 50/200 will get you more depth capability over the 600w which might not be important depending on where you go.
 
The SCX20 is a major advantage. Everything is aligned perfectly always if using radar overlay. Autopilot is more accurate (if you've ever had a magnetic sensor be off heading one direction and correct when heading another direction, that's a thing of the past) If you need to save money, keep the transducer and spend on the SCX20.

That was always an annoyance on my former Simrad NSS setup. The RADAR scan never aligned well with the chart land masses. Usually it was off by a significant margin.

Truthfully, I just lived with it and never knew which one to trust. Fortunately, I never encountered a scenario where it put me in danger. I've no idea if there was calibration that might have addressed it or if that's just the nature of having the fluxgate compass in the mix. Regardless, if having RADAR overlay aligned is a benefit of the SCX20, that's a good enough reason for me to get it.

Thanks for the feedback.
 
The SCX20 is very accurate and would make an excellent upgrade to a fluxgate in general. However, it's only going to be as good as the installation. There is a calibration to be performed called an "Heading Alignment." For Furuno radars it goes as follows: (See photo)

In general, I would always calibrate a radar to an actual landmass target like a seawall or shoreline first, rather than rely on charting.

- Maggy
 

Attachments

  • FireShot Capture 753 -  - furunousa.com.png
    FireShot Capture 753 - - furunousa.com.png
    132.2 KB · Views: 14
Here's an example of how things line up and stay that way with the 2' NXT dome. The edges of the land line right up good. The green nav buoy with the 5 SW of the boat target lines right up the radar return. Bigger open arrays provide similar function with finer detail.

Untitledr (1).pngUntitledr (1).png
 
If you don't have a good working compass to start with I can't say enough good about SCX20. Rock solid plus it gives very good GPS data to your plotter et cetera.
 
Thanks for the quick reply! The existing thru-hull transducer is connected to a Garmin 2006C, but I don't know the model yet. Boat to be fetched in a few weeks. Tech support also suggested it may be compatible with a connector change, but of course - absent the model number they couldn't say with certainty. Sounds like a great place to save some $$, at least trying it first before upgrading if needed.

There is no magnetic/electronic compass currently on the boat. My preference is to stick with Furuno equipment absent a reason not to, and I'm fairly certain I'll have good locations away from magnetic interference to install the PG700.

I'm also hoping to incorporate engine telemetry from the 2017 Suzuki 200 outboard. I think it has NMEA 2000 capabilities, and does have the electronic display showing fuel burn, range, etc. As cool as that gauge is, there's not much room on the dash...I'm hopeful I can lose the electronic Suzuki gauge, putting the NavPilot 300 in its place. I'd only do that if the data the Suzuki gauge displays can be replicated on the MFD, though.

And, an AIS transponder is under consideration - but that's the one area I'm considering a non-Furuno device. I've heard nothing but good about the Vesper unit, but plenty of research to do there as well.

Thanks again, Johnny!
Huge fan of the Vesper unit here for AIS. XB8000 on my last boat and I installed Cortex on this boat. However, i'm not at all happy with the performance of the Cortex VHF and that is a major disappointment.
 
Apologies for digging up a year-old thread, but given I started it - it's definitely relevant. To me, anyway, :cool:

I never pulled the trigger last year on this system upgrade. Primarily because of product shortages, specifically the SCX20. I didn't want to be sitting on a bunch of components waiting on backorders, so I decided to revisit things once availability was better.

In looking online over the last few days and chatting with a couple vendors, it looks like everything is now readily available. However...my delay seems to have been fortuitous, as the new TZTouchXL's look like a no brainer of an upgrade from the TXT12F I'd originally planned on. Trust I'm not asking for estimates on availability of these new units, I'm certainly cautious with any manufacturer's estimates.

Reason for the post: I'd like to get everything else now and start in with the installation. Given I'll be mounting the MFD on an easily accessible shelf on a bracket, it's about the easiest part of the install. My thought was, to get the cheapest, used, functional Furuno MFD I could find off eBay or elsewhere that would work with all the other components, selling it once the TZTouchXL's start shipping. I don't even necessarily care about size for the short term - smaller than 12" is fine. This would get me up and going ASAP and I could finish off the new system once the new MFD's start shipping.

Can anyone provide a short list of Furuno MFD's that might meet this need? Again, unlike the all the new components - cost is definitely a primary consideration given it will be temporary. As long as I have basic navigational needs including AP in place, I'm not terribly concerned about display and new functions for the few months I'll be waiting on the new MFD.
 
Running a pilot/radar etc you could go as far back as the TZT series one 9" (TZT9), or go with the newer TZT2 12" (TZTL12F), or the even newer TZT3 9" (TZT9F). Options are there for sure.
 
Back
Top