IF-NMEA2K2 and Yamaha Command Link

MarMax

Furuno Super Fan
Had the boat out for the first time with the TZT9, Navpilot and DFF3D. Note that the Navnet system is a combined MFD8/TZT9 and that when last run in the garage all sensors were recognized and set up in the MFD8 installation wizard.

Upon startup the MFD8 did not recognize the PG700 or Yamaha gateway. Went into the wizard and these sensors were not available as choices. Note that the Navpilot was seeing the PG700 just fine. Also note that I turn the DFF3D off when I run the wizard on the MFD8. So I exit the wizard and then run it again and on the second round still no sensors. On the third round with the wizard the sensors appeared, were configured, saved and exited. Why this happens is a mystery to me. And note that the MFD8 did this before the TZT and DFF3D were added to the network.

The MFD8 seemed happy on restart and I checked the connection diagram and everything was present, including the Yamaha N2K gateway. On the water yesterday there was no engine data displayed. The engine data has displayed fine in the past so I need help troubleshooting the engine data communication problem.

Next issue is in using the IF-NMEA2K2 to provide NMEA0183 data to my Yamaha Command Link Speed gauge. The data that I wish to provide to the Speed gauge is GPS-time, GPS-speed, SST and depth. In the past I used my NMEA0183 out from the MFD8 to provide this data and everything worked.

With the IF-NMEA2K2 I was not getting any depth data and the time data was UTC (I think) and was 5 hours later than Pacific time. The Speed gauge has no provision to correct the GPS time, it merely displays whatever data it receives. Can this be corrected? And why is the depth data not being provided?
 
NMEA 2000 GPS is going to provide the time in UTC and the device would need to have any time offset. It should have been the same when you ran it 0183. Being that you are still running the MFD8, I wonder why you even changed that working connection. The IF-NMEA2k2 should convert the PGN 128267 to 0183 depth as long as the PGN is on your NMEA 2000 bus. Maybe you are using a NETWORK sounder and need to turn On the PGN output from your NN3D to get the depth on your NMEA 2000 bus?
 
Edited to say that I checked the setup wizard for N2K PGNs that are selected for Tx and 128267 is selected. So I'm not sure why depth is not passing over to Command Link.

Also edited to add the last paragraph about TZT2 and Command Link.

Bummer about the time though. The MFD8 must have provided system time when I had its NMEA0183 going to Command Link. I want to be able to function without the MFD8 so I've switched over to the IF-NMEA2K2. Looks like I'm stuck with UTC for time. I'll probably just turn off the time on the Speed gauge.

I've also done some more testing with the engines running and I no longer get engine data for both. Only port engine data comes through on the MFD8. Another mystery since this used to work fine. I'll need to do some more testing with just the TZT and see if I get the same result. Would still like any suggestions for things the check/try.

Was engine data programming changed for the MFD8 with software V2.13 vs. V2.07?

All of this has me really thinking about dumping the MFD8 altogether. I did not want to put a big box up on the dash but it's looking like a TZTL12F may be a way to move forward. I see there is a guide
[https://www.furunousa.com/-/media/s...net_tztouch2_and_yamaha_gauge_information.pdf]
on the TZT2 and Yamaha Command Link but it does not mention the Yamaha MAR-GTWAY-ML-09 which is what I currently have. It only mentions the 6YG-8A2D0-00 gateway which is $330. According the Yamaha the MAR-GTWAY-ML-09 is the correct one to use with Command Link and the 6YG-8A2D0-00 is intended for Command Link Plus (but it does work with Command Link) , so will the MAR-GTWAY-ML-09 work with the TZT2 and the engine setup menu?

And last question is if the TZtouch2 uses the same power and ethernet cable connections as the TZT/MFD8?
 
MarMax":2bfem51y said:
Bumping with a Quote to say that I checked the setup wizard for N2K PGNs that are selected for Tx and 128267 is selected. So I'm not sure why depth is not passing over to Command Link.

Also added the paragraph about TZT2 and Command Link.

As a test I ran the system with the TZT9 only and system time passed over to Command Link (PST or UTC -8). So probably just another reason to get rid of the MFD8.

Hopefully the engine date issue will also be solved by replacing the MFD8 with a TSTL12F.

MarMax":2bfem51y said:
I did not want to put a big box up on the dash but it's looking like a TZTL12F may be a way to move forward.

I see there is a Furuno guide on the TZT2 and Command Link and Command Link+:
[https://www.furunousa.com/-/media/s...net_tztouch2_and_yamaha_gauge_information.pdf]

Another experiment I'll have to try is to see if the TZT2 and Yamaha Command Link will communicate with a Yamaha MAR-GTWAY-ML-09 which is what I currently have. The guide only mentions the 6YG-8A2D0-00 gateway which is another $330 and is on backorder until mid-April.

The MAR-GTWAY-ML-09 is supposedly the correct gateway for use with Command Link and the 6YG-8A2D0-00 gateway is for Command Link Plus. The guide and Yamaha both agree that the newer (6YG-8A2D0-00) gateway does work with Command Link. So the big question is if I'll get the Yamaha menu on the TZT2 if I'm using the MAR-GTWAY-ML-09.

MarMax":2bfem51y said:
And I'd still like to know if the TZtouch2 uses the same power and ethernet cable connections as the TZT/MFD8?
 
I'm bringing this back to life with a question regarding the IF-NMEA2K2 and data to Yamaha Command Link. I'm now a TZT and TZT2 mixed system. The MFD8 was donated to Furuno for parts quite a while back. Everything in the data communication between Furuno and Yamaha is working fine except for time. The data stream is depth, SST and time. The time is coming through to Yamaha, except is not correct. Last time out is was +4 hours.

In my TZT/TZT2 system the only CAN bus Tx data is from the TZT9. The TZT2 does not Tx any data. My GPS is connected through the radar so I believe it's the same as it being on the N2K network. The only thing I can think of is the IF-NMEA2K2 is taking the GPS data instead of the TZT data. I've set my MFD's for UTC -7 for correct time an hoped that this is what would be sent to Yamaha. Unfortunately I'm not getting the correct time over to Yamaha. Is there any suggestions on solving this? Thanks.
 
My GPS is connected through the radar so I believe it's the same as it being on the N2K network.

The NMEA 2000 bus is not the same as the Furuno Canbus connector in the radar. If your GPS is going into the radar, it will come into the system via the radar Ethernet. For GPS data to get to your established NMEA 2000 network, you would need to turn on the appropriate PGNs. (unless you have another source that is directly on your 2000 bus)

What is your time offset for your area? I suspect is the Yamaha is not correcting for your time offset. Understand that date/time from GPS is in UTC time. Although your TZT units and other items have a time offset, the raw GPS data isn't modified. Yamaha should have a place to conduct an offset like Furuno does. It doesn't matter if the GPS is being pumped from the TZT PGN or a PGN direct from a bus connected GPS; GPS time is in UTC.
 
Currently in the Los Angeles area it's UTC -7

Both MFD's are set at UTC -7 and I did try one thing available with the Yamaha gauge to reset the time. The Yamaha manual says that in GPS mode "the local time is easily displayed by calculating the longitude information received from the GPS communication data".

When I reset the time on the Yamaha gauge it then appears correctly (UTC -7) as it's probably received from the MFD. However, once I shut off the engines and then restart them I'm back to the wrong time on the gauge. Seems crazy to have to reset the time every time I start the engines.

I did call Yamaha and they were of no help at all. The strangest part of this is that when I had the MFD8 providing NMEA0183 data to Yamaha, everything worked fine all the time, for many years. Now with the IF-NMEA2K2 I'm not able to get correct time to Yamaha.
 
It must have something to do with the newer 0183 provided by the IF-NMEA2k2 (uses v3 NMEA 0183). Maybe the Yamaha is programmed to support older versions of NMEA 0813 and doesn't like v3. You might try an Actisense converter. I understand they had different firmware to support older versions of 0183. Maybe Yamaha has new firmware?
 
Johnny, I don't have anything new to report but I did read your response regarding TZT 6.02 software. Do you think that minor bug with the IF-NMEA2k2 where it is mis-recognized but sorts itself out could be causing any weirdness with the time? Or, as you stated, it's more likely a NMEA 0183 v3 issue.
 
It would be more like they v3 of the NMEA 0183 or something else. 6.02 should be out at the end of the week but I doubt it will change what you are seeing.
 
Johnny,

Another thing that's a variable in the mix for my system is how I do testing in the garage. Since GPS is so critical to run the system I have a Garmin 19x GPS that I put outside when running all the electronics in the garage. Since my GP330B is connected to the DRS I just leave the DRS off when garage testing. I connect the 19x to the N2K network and run everything else with the sounders in standby.

Your statement that the GP330B data is communicated via the TZT and not N2K caught my attention and now I have some follow up. The IF-NMEA2K2 just converts all the N2K data to 0183. On the water, the TZT provides the data to Yamaha. When I'm garage testing the Garmin 19x is providing data to the N2K network, in addition to the PGNs that the TZT is outputting. So I may not be able to figure out the time problem in the garage.

I suspect this is also why I've thought I'd figured it out and then it's all wrong when on the water. Sorry for the long babble, but you need all the information on the situation to help out.
 
The problem with long threads and answering a ton of questions, it is easy to lose track.

Your GPS is connected to the radar CanBus connection or the main NMEA 2000 bus?

You are now using the IF-NMEA2k2 to pull 0183 data for the engines, which used to draw out directly from the MFD8?

The Time/Date of the Engine system was correct when using the MFD8 0183 data, but not with the converted IF-NMEA2k2?
 
The GP330B is connected to the DRS. This is my only GPS when out on the water. When I'm in the garage (no signal for the GP330B) I use a Garmin 19x GPS that is connected to the N2K network and I leave the DRS power off.

When I had the MFD8, outputting to Yamaha via the MFD8's NMEA0183 output, the time/date was always correct. I did not pay much attention to the settings since the Yamaha gauge always matched the MFD8. The DRS and GP330B setup has always been the same. If I knew what I know now when I originally set up the system I would have connected the GP330B directly to the N2K network. I will do it eventually but not at this time.

I'm assuming if I have the TZT9 set to output the time/date PGN and it's also set to UTC -7, the time/date PGN that it output is adjusted. If not then there is no point in trying to figure it out.

As always, thanks for any assistance you can provide.
 
Can you confirm that this is a problem with the boat outside using the GP330B as a source (still connected to the radar), with the newest software 6.02 and the PGNs turned on?

Garmin GPS units are known not to provided mag var information so I don't like them as a source. (I wouldn't get concerned about things with the boat in the shed using it as a source)

Just curious, I know you have a TZT/TZT2 mixed system now; have you tried driving the engine 0183 data from the TZT2? (results?)

Based on your answers, we will start some testing to find out why the NN3D 0183 was accepted by the Yamaha but the IF-NMEA2k2 0183 doesn't appear to be (for date/time).
 
Johnny Electron":17uu1c2p said:
Can you confirm that this is a problem with the boat outside using the GP330B as a source (still connected to the radar), with the newest software 6.02 and the PGNs turned on?

I just did the 6.02 install on the TZT. I'm now at 6.02-TZT and 6.21-TZT2, but have not been out on the water yet.

Just curious, I know you have a TZT/TZT2 mixed system now; have you tried driving the engine 0183 data from the TZT2? (results?)

I have not tried this since it's some extra cabling to set it up, plus the TZT2 is primarily for the sounders, radar and Yamaha screen. I'd like to figure it out without having the TZT2 output PGNs. I'd like the keep the TZT the main/boss MFD, but using the TZT2 for 0183 data is an option if nothing else works.

Based on your answers, we will start some testing to find out why the NN3D 0183 was accepted by the Yamaha but the IF-NMEA2k2 0183 doesn't appear to be (for date/time).

Thank you Johnny. I should have the boat out again in the next couple weeks and will report back on the date/time findings. Last time I was out the TZT had 6.01 that the tech support guys provided so I could beta test so I really do need to see how things look with 6.02 and the IF-NMEA2K2 bug fix.
 
Johnny Electron":afqpwttb said:
Can you confirm that this is a problem with the boat outside using the GP330B as a source (still connected to the radar), with the newest software 6.02 and the PGNs turned on?

I just did the 6.02 install on the TZT. I'm now at 6.02-TZT and 6.21-TZT2, but have not been out on the water yet.

Just curious, I know you have a TZT/TZT2 mixed system now; have you tried driving the engine 0183 data from the TZT2? (results?)

I have not tried this since it's some extra cabling to set it up, plus the TZT2 is primarily for the sounders, radar and Yamaha screen. I'd like to figure it out without having the TZT2 output PGNs. I'd like the keep the TZT the main/boss MFD, but using the TZT2 for 0183 data is an option if nothing else works.

Based on your answers, we will start some testing to find out why the NN3D 0183 was accepted by the Yamaha but the IF-NMEA2k2 0183 doesn't appear to be (for date/time).

Thank you Johnny. I should have the boat out again in the next couple weeks and will report back on the date/time findings. Last time I was out the TZT had 6.01 that the tech support guys provided so I could beta test so I really do need to see how things look with 6.02 and the IF-NMEA2K2 bug fix.
 
Johnny, I've completed more testing and thought I'd add another comment here. It appears that using PGN 126992 instead of PGN 129033 displays the correct time on Yamaha. As mentioned previously, only the TZT is set to output N2K PGNs. The TZT2 has all N2K PGNs set to OFF.

I also updated the TZT2 to V6.23 (from V6.21) prior to this most recent testing.
 
Good that you found a working solution. We will ensure that the other PGN data is looked for possible changes down the road.
 
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