Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby MarMax » Sat Nov 25, 2017 1:30 pm

For the Navpilot 711C system, is the only communication with the navnet network done via the CAN bus (N2K)?

Is the intended CAN bus configuration to have the FAP-7002 and PG700 each going to the backbone separately?

I know with a NN3D/TZT network the TZT is not connected to the MFD8's N2K network. So the TZT sees the autopilot via its navnet connection? Is navnet converting and passing N2K autopilot info to the TZT?

Could the autopilot be connected just to a separate TZT N2K network? With this would autopilot data pass to the navnet system? Will heading info via the PG700 connected to the NN3D N2K network still come over to the TZT? The basic underlying question is with each MFD running its own but separate N2K network, does navnet pass/share all this data between the MFD8 and TZT without violating the N2K rule?
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby C-Bass » Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:48 am

Good morning MarMax,

Thank you for your inquiry.

1.) For the Navpilot 711C system, is the only communication with the navnet network done via the CAN bus (N2K)? The NavPilot 711C can use both NMEA2000 data and NMEA0183 data. The NavPilot 711C has (2) NMEA0183 ports.

2.)Is the intended CAN bus configuration to have the FAP7002 and PG700 each going to the backbone separately? Yes/no. Depending on the complexity of the installation the PG700 could be wired directly to the FAP7002 if it was going to be the only NMEA2000 device. However, if there is other equipment on the vessel that will need to communicate with the FAP7002 then it would be best to create a NMEA2000 Backbone and wire the FAP7002 and PG700 with separate drop cables.

3.) I know with a NN3D/TZT network the TZT is not connected to the MFD8's N2K network. So the TZT sees the autopilot via its navnet connection? Is navnet converting and passing N2K autopilot info to the TZT? In a mixed network that has a NN3D unit and a TZT unit you are correct; the TZT unit is not connected to the NMEA2000 backbone. In this case only the NN3D would be connected to the N2K backbone. So in this network, the MFD8 would be connected to the TZT via Ethernet. When these two products are connected via Ethernet they have active waypoint synchronization. So if you were to activate a waypoint on the TZT it would feed the information to the MFD8 via Ethernet. Now if the MFD8 was connected to a NMEA2000 backbone and you also had the NavPilot 711C connected to the backbone the MFD8 would communicate the waypoint information to the NavPilot 711C that originated from the TZT. Please keep in mind the MFD8 would need to be programmed to output the correct NMEA2000 PGN's from the Installation Wizard.

4.) Could the autopilot be connected just to a separate TZT N2K network? With this would autopilot data pass to the navnet system? Will heading info via the PG700 connected to the NN3D N2K network still come over to the TZT? The basic underlying question is with each MFD running its own but separate N2K network, does navnet pass/share all this data between the MFD8 and TZT without violating the N2K rule? No, this would violate the mixed network rules. When a NN3D unit and a TZT unit are connected via Ethernet, then the NN3D becomes the data master and is the only unit that should be connected to anything NMEA2000.


Kind Regards,

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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby MarMax » Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:02 am

C-Bass,

Thank you for the detailed responses. I'm completely on board with the requirement that the TZT is not connected to N2K in any way. I've been in contact with another boat owner that is running a mixed NN3D(BB) and TZT12 system and he is following the no N2K rule for the TZT and is running a Simrad autopilot.

I'll be receiving my TZT9 soon so I've been asking lots of questions in preparation for the install. I do not have any other systems that will need data from the FAP7002 besides the MFD and TZT and I also have a small N2K network on the MFD side. Since the PG700 can be connected to the FAP7002 I'll probably go that route since I only have 4 ports on my N2K.

Currently I have the MFD, Yamaha Gateway and SSC200 (heading sensor) connected with one available port. So I could replace the SSC200 with the PG700 and use the last port for the FAP7002 or connect the PG700 to the FAP7002 and replace the SSC200. Sounds like both are equivalent if I don't need the FAP7002 to talk to other equipment.

Is there something more complete than page 27 of the 711C installation manual that describes how to connect the PG700 and N2K drop cable to TB11 of the FAP7002?
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby C-Bass » Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:26 am

Good afternoon MarMax,

I am a little confused. If you plan to connect the NavPilot 711C to the MFD8 via N2K backbone then you will not be able to wire the PG700 directly to the FAP7002. The FAP7002 only has (1) N2K port. Typically directly wiring the PG700 to the N2K port is for use in a standalone system when no connection to a GPS Chartplotter is needed.

In your case it would be best to wire the PG700 to the backbone that the NavPilot is on and the MFD8. Then all the system components will be able to access data from the PG700. You want to make sure that the GPS Chart plotter, in your case the MFD8, and the NavPilot 711C are using the same heading source.

Yes you could replace the SSC200 with the PG700, then use the remaining N2K port to connect the FAP7002. Then the MFD systems and the NavPilot systems will use the PG700 has the heading source.

If you want to integrate the MFD's and the NavPilot then you will not be able to directly wire the PG700 to the FAP7002.

Please review the link below.

https://www.furunousa.com/-/media/sites/furuno/document_library/technical_info/interfacing_and_installation/interfacing_and_installation_dealers_only/navpilot_700_711_720_sample_connection_diagrams.pdf

Kind Regards,
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby MarMax » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:52 am

C-Bass,

Thank you again for the reply and my apology for the confusion. Actually I just misunderstood your statement:

Depending on the complexity of the installation the PG700 could be wired directly to the FAP7002 if it was going to be the only NMEA2000 device.


I read this as the only N2K device connected with the FAP7002 at TB11. My error there as it's clear that TB11 can only have one N2K connection. The connection diagram just threw me off since it shows a PG700 connected there.

And thank you for the additional info regarding heading sensors.
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby MarMax » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:44 pm

I've finished mounting and wiring up all the system components (MFD8, TZT9, FAP7002, 711C, PG700, DFF3D, DFF1 and the pump). Did the location test for the PG700 and all good. First startup with the MFD8 was all good. Note that when ever I need to run the installation wizard on the MFD8 I switch off the DFF3D as the MFD8 will hang up in the wizard if I forget.

First run of the installation wizard an all good. The PG700 is there as the heading sensor and the SSC200 is gone (replaced by the PG700), all else fine. Restart and all is good. Both the MFD8 and TZT9 are seeing the PG700. So I shut down. For the record the PG700 is connected to the N2K backbone, not the FAP7002.

Now I power up the Navpilot for the first time by itself with just the N2K network on. It starts up all OK except the "NG" for heading. I go through the initial setup steps in the manual and it's pretty straight forward. Where I get hung up is with the CAN bus. The PG700 is not listed as a device. I know it starts up OK so I shut down to restart with the entire system.

Start up the MFD8, the TZT, the 711C. Same deal for the Navpilot with the "NG" for heading. The MFD8 and TZT see the PG700 just fine. Just to be sure I run the installation wizard again for the MFD8 so I can turn on a bunch of the N2K output sentences. Restart it and now the PG700 is gone. Run the wizard a second time and no PG700 available to select as a device. OK, been here before with my NN3D weirdness back when the DFF1 failed.

So I shut down the MFD8 and connect the TZT9 up to the N2K network and restart with just the TZT and all is good, it sees the PG700 just fine. Start up the Navpilot and same deal with "NG" for heading. OK, now I'm beginning to see maybe I have a CAN bus issue with the FAP7002, but what? It's wired exactly as it says in the manual.

I have no idea how the MFDs recognize the Navpilot since I've never had one before. The MFD8 manual says nothing about an autopilot. The TZT manual has a little bit of information. It's all CAN bus communication but I'm not sure how to do some testing of the FAP7002 to see if it's communicating with the network.
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby Johnny Electron » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:11 am

Under your setup, the communication would be from your MFD8 via NMEA 2000 to the pilot. You would turn on the approprate PGN output sentences in the setup wizard. In the pilot you would pick your sensor sources and your Nav Option (MFD8). At that point, you should be able to drop a point, go to, and then test "Nav" on the pilot to see if it tries to steer.
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Re: Navpilot 711C on NN3D/TZT network

Postby MarMax » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:32 am

Johnny,

EDITED TO ADD: Big goof on my part, had the blue/white CAN bus wires backwards in the FAP7002 so that solves most of the issues. Also confirmed that the PGNs set on the MFD8 are:

129025, 129026, 129029, 12983, 129284, 129285 [Edited 2nd time to say that PGN 12985 is not in the list of output PGNs in the wizard]

I do follow the communication logic which was provided previously and shown below:

3.) I know with a NN3D/TZT network the TZT is not connected to the MFD8's N2K network. So the TZT sees the autopilot via its navnet connection? Is navnet converting and passing N2K autopilot info to the TZT? In a mixed network that has a NN3D unit and a TZT unit you are correct; the TZT unit is not connected to the NMEA2000 backbone. In this case only the NN3D would be connected to the N2K backbone. So in this network, the MFD8 would be connected to the TZT via Ethernet. When these two products are connected via Ethernet they have active waypoint synchronization. So if you were to activate a waypoint on the TZT it would feed the information to the MFD8 via Ethernet. Now if the MFD8 was connected to a NMEA2000 backbone and you also had the NavPilot 711C connected to the backbone the MFD8 would communicate the waypoint information to the NavPilot 711C that originated from the TZT. Please keep in mind the MFD8 would need to be programmed to output the correct NMEA2000 PGN's from the Installation Wizard.


Also note that I'm testing in the garage, not on the water, at least until I get it all communicating properly. This means no viable GPS signal which probably limits what I can do.

I'll need to complete the Navpilot installation as well. I have not hooked up the hydraulics yet and need to do so. Will be back with more questions later.

Thank you!!
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